Don't Walk Away
This evening while I was driving home from Michelle's, I was listening to a Christian radio station here in Louisville and the radio host was interviewing a lady who had worked in an abortion clinic before coming to faith in Jesus.
It was a very interesting listen. She admitted that she was involved in the DEATH of nearly 35,000 unborn children, even the death of her OWN child. Also, she told stories of how the nurses and doctors would deceive the women by telling them that they are pregnant when, in actuality, they are not. In doing so, the business would profit from this deception. The issue is not the money, but rather, it's the deception.
So, what, right? Well, this shows that the abortion clinic workers and doctors do not care about the women and, obviously, the unborn children. Who could have the heart to murder an unborn child? I know there are arguments about when life actually begins but let's think about this:
- At conception, a separate, unique, human individual with its own genetic code comes into being, needing only food, water, shelter, and oxygen to grow and develop.
-Like the infant, the child, and the adolescent, the unborn baby is a being in the process of becoming. He/She isn’t a potential human life, but a human life with potential. The fetus doesn’t become more and more human and of greater and greater value. You didn’t come from a zygote, you once were a zygote (fetus, embryo, child).
-The Official Senate report on Senate Bill 158, the "Human Life Bill", summarized the issue this way: "Physicians, biologists, and other scientists agree that conception marks the beginning of the life of a human being - a being that is alive and a member of the human species. There is overwhelming agreement on this point in countless medical, biological, and scientific writings."
-Everything that determines the individuality & originality of a person is established at conception. The first single cell contains the entire genetic blueprint in all its complexity.
-The baby is fully developed before his mother's pregnancy is even noticeable.
-There is no essential difference between an unborn entity and a newborn baby, just a difference in location.
So, what does the Bible say about Abortion?
Psalm 139: 13-16 – “For you created my inmost being; you knit me together in my mother's womb. 14 I praise you because I am fearfully and wonderfully made; your works are wonderful, I know that full well. 15 My frame was not hidden from you when I was made in the secret place. When I was woven together in the depths of the earth, 16 your eyes saw my unformed body. All the days ordained for me were written in your book before one of them came to be.”
Jeremiah 1:5 - "Before I formed you in the womb I knew you, before you were born I set you apart; I appointed you as a prophet to the nations."
Gen. 25:21-22 - “…and Rebekah his [Isaac’s] wife conceived. And the children struggled together within her…”
Jacob and Esau are referred to as “children.” The Hebrew word used, commonly refers to children after birth, and often has a more specific meaning, “sons.”
Luke 1:41-44 uses the usual Greek word for baby, brephos, to refer to the unborn John the Baptist, who “leaped in her [Elizabeth’s] womb” because of the presence of the unborn Christ.
Ex. 21:22-25 - In Old Testament Israel, a criminal injury that caused a pregnant woman’s unborn child to die was treated the same as any other murder. The criminal was punished less severely, only if the baby was born alive, although premature.
Things that make you go, hmmm…
-Why is abortion OK, while killing a baby a pregnant woman is carrying is considered murder? Only difference is that one child is wanted!
-Why is abortion OK, but killing logger-head sea turtle eggs can get you arrested? Animals are great and should be protected, but it is absolutely asinine that we would adore animals and abort babies!
-“Pro-choice”… Does the baby get a choice? Pro-choice is really pro-abortion/pro-murder.
Final Thoughts...
YOU could have been aborted...
YOU could have been rejected and unloved by your mother...
YOU could have been considered a "nothing"...
YOU could have been killed for no reason...
YOU could have been considered a nuisance...
You could have been helplessly murdered...
...but by the grace of God, you are alive.
(information provided by Daryl Summey, FBC Eastman, Ga)
9 comments:
Hi Kyle, a few comments from the resident Atheist.
First off , let me just dictate my stance, I am against late term abortion, in my opinion 2-3 weeks into the pregnancy is ok, anything after that is on shaky ground. I don't believe life begins at conception...so I am a little bit middle of the road. EITHER WAY, we are men and we really don't have as much right as the ladies do to speak out on this one...
on to my critique:
The first thing I see here is a straw man argument and a gross generalization about abortion clinics being out to deceive and get money from confused and scared women. It does nothing for any side, it only makes the interviewee sound like maybe she was heartless and uncaring---something that permeates well beyond non-Christians into every aspect of society. My point is that it doesn't help your argument one bit. Some abortionists are probably vile and evil people...others are just as well doing what they think they have to do to help people in bad situations...
ON to conception...Conception is when the DNA forms and begins splitting, that doesn't mean that you are actually killing a baby, you are killing something that will become a baby shortly. Is it alive...well technically yes, but is it immoral to destroy microscopic lives? thats certainly debateable.
The embryo will become a human life uninhibited...but there has to be a time between conception and birth where the moral aspect of it is less grim.
Yes, the genetics are there, which means the embryo already has potential traits stored...but that doesn't make it immoral
Now, partial birth abortions...i agree with you on, late term abortion IMO is very wrong and is equivalent to murder...i just think there has to be a middle ground, a point in which you are only destroying the potential of human life instead of the life itself. Still gray area there to me.
as far as what the Bible says, as if it made a difference to me of course...check out this very interesting article:
http://www.elroy.net/ehr/abortion.html
I won't bother arguing either side on that one.
My only question that I ever feel is necessary to ask those that are in the Pro-Life movement is this:
If the child you fight to save turns out to be a homosexual, would you still fight to save that life? Would you fight for their rights then?
nice read kyle, keep it up
Matt aka http://ragingrev.com
First of all, you asked: "If the child you fight to save turns out to be a homosexual, would you still fight to save that life?"
Matt, I would fight to save that life. My reason, all lifestyle choices aside, is because that person is still a human being created in the image of God. A lifestyle choice does not determine whether or not a human being is a human being. Plain and simple.
Secondly, you said: "Conception is when the DNA forms and begins splitting, that doesn't mean that you are actually killing a baby, you are killing something that will become a baby shortly. Is it alive...well technically yes, but is it immoral to destroy microscopic lives? thats certainly debateable."
Matt, as soon as the sperm hits the egg, that's life. You said that it is "technically alive,"..and in reality, it's still alive. This is when God begins to create life. Is it immoral to destroy something that is alive? Well, let's throw you back in the womb and consider abortion. Would you want to fight for your own life even at the molecular stage?
Good chat, Matt.
Matt,
I wanted to comment on one phrase that you told Kyle: "we are men and we really don't have as much right as the ladies do to speak out on this one..."
When I read that I immediately was like: "yeah they do!" As a guy you have a lot of right to speak up for/against abortion. Yes, as women we carry the baby, but as men, ya'll make up half the product! A baby is half it's father and half it's mother, as I know you understand.
I can see why men think they don't have a right to say anything about abortion because our nation focuses so much on the life of the mother and her rights. However, I have to strongly disagree with that thinking. Even if I was raped, I would still carry that baby inside of me and never consider my rights as a woman more important than the rights of the child inside of me! Yes, the woman should have final say in whether she chooses to abort or not, but men should definitely speak up for what they feel is right.
Why is it that women are left to themselves to speak up for the rights of them and their children? What ever happened to chivalry? Where are the real men in our nation? They are all turning into women... who they think should have all the rights... when as yet, do they?
I don't mean that all men are like this... of course! It just seems that our nation is loosing focus of what is truely right. I know that "right" means something different for many people, but there is no escaping TRUTH... no matter how you look at it... even with abortion!
Just thought I'd put my two cents in! :-)
@ Kyle:
"Lifestyle choice" is debatable...even the disowned and dethroned Ted Haggard has to admit that now.
whether or not I would fight for my life at the molecular stage is silly...as I am only a little glob of cells with no intelligence or will...so that would be difficult to do.
@ Michelle:
Yes, I understand how babby is formed...but i was speaking more to the less responsible men whom try to make these decisions for women...legislators that have no grasp on the concepts of hardship that some of the women that seek abortions endure. What right have they to take issue with what that woman decides to do? i say none.
At least in my limited experience it is the men that take this issue on so loudly...women seem to be more pro choice if you look at an abortion rally...there are almost always more men and brainwashed little kids on the pro-life side and far more women on the pro choice side...I think the correct way is to find a happy medium (which means that it gets out of the national debate...which is absolutely ruining what democracy should be...abortion is a states rights issue IMHO)
and Michelle...the difference between Chivalry and Chauvinism is a fine line...how in the world are we supposed to know what woman wants what? Women truly are the mystery of the ages.
and I am not sure what TRUTH you are referring to?
@ Kyle,
as I said before, even the disgraced Ted Haggard won't call it a lifestyle choice any longer.
I made my position clear that there is a point in the womb at which abortion becomes the murder of a human life...and there is a point at which it is merely destroying the potential for humanity...
I can't look retroactively at myself in the womb...there is a reason for that...but God's grace has nothing whatsoever to do with it...I wasn't aborted--no god involved...is it Gods curse when a child IS aborted?
IF my life was not...meaning I didn't have a life to speak of and I was aborted...i wouldn't care at all...i wouldn't be...No one would miss me because I would have never been here...I don't miss anything because I never experienced anything to miss... I know I would not be if I had been aborted..thats kinda the point.
In the middle of what may potentially be a peak crisis of population...abortion isn't a bad idea...eugenics was really popular back in Jesus' day, yet he never made any speech regarding it..., ever wonder why that was?
Like i said though, i am not promoting a eugenics agenda...but an emergency intervention within the first 2-3 weeks seems reasonable in every way.
Rev-
It's the resident Pro-Life activist here, and yes, I'm a guy. Surprise! :)
1) As far as consistency goes, your arguments have absolutely zero. You affirm that there IS a point that an embryo becomes a protectable human being, but you offer absolutely no philosophical argument to support your stance. And even if you did, it wouldn't be tenable. At least a die-hard pro-abort consistently denies the existence of all "human life" prior to [wanted] birth. You arbitrarily set a standard based upon what seems to be pure, unadulterated atheistic emotion. That wouldn't stand up in Judge Judy's court, much less in a court of ethics.
2) The fact that you claim that the destruction of "microscopic lives" is "debatable" is ethically shallow. Just because someone is willing to debate an issue doesn't cast that issue into the abyss of unintelligibility. There are people willing to debate whether we landed on the moon, or whether Elvis is really alive; but the facts remain to stare us in the face. While you yourself may be unconvinced, biology is not. The fact that human embryos ALWAYS grow up to be human beings is a monument to the clarity of this "debatable" argument. If indeed you do have a debate, your issue is with science and humanity, not Christianity.
3) Your allusion to a "population crisis" is laughable as well. Have you seen the latest demographics for the entire Western Hemisphere? All point to a looming demographic winter. And besides, such an argument as population control is contingent upon the affirmation that the aborted child is indeed a part of the population of our common humanity. Yet again the truth comes out.
4)Your underlying problem as a self-professed atheist is that you really have no means to argue against murder at all, much less murder of the unborn (at any point in pregnancy). Mankind made in the image of nothing has nothing sacred about it to protect. We are reduced to mere higher-level mammals, clinging to some imaginary social contract to keep us from murdering each other out of shear rage. Once you deny the existence of God, you have no more foundation to claim a right to live than a brute beast. If a man bigger and stronger than you decided that you no longer served his purposes, you would have no philosophical leg to stand on. He would have the "right as might" to decide your humanity, regardless of your claim to life.
And what a sad, sad day that would be.
'BH
'BH - "The fact that human embryos ALWAYS grow up to be human beings..."
Amen. Humans produce humans and that's the way it works..it's not rocket science. A woman will never produce a cat or a dog or anything other than another human being. Again, as I've said before, a human being is a human being no matter the size or age (womb, child, adult, elderly) or location.
Choose this day whom you will serve!
@ Lawn:
I appreciate your response.
On 1:
I wasn’t making an attempt at philosophical argument…which clearly explains the lack of it in my comments. Clearly at conception organic matter exists and begins reproducing itself. Brainwaves and heartbeats do not begin until a few weeks after this point, some point during or after those first waves begin I would certainly begin to think that human life was there, vs. just self replicating information. I know quite a pro-choice (abort) individuals, as far as I have ever heard from them the view that birth and “wanted” birth was the definition behind life is non-existent…you may be talking about some hardcore folks that will deny the facts…you and I will agree there…im just middle of the road on abortion and want to present a view that considers both sides of a huge debate…
On 2:
I don’t disagree, I just think that we should be investigating the point at which a thinking being is destroyed vs. the point at which a reproducing mass of cells is destroyed. The fact is, human embryos do not always grow up… they often to not survive the conditions of the womb or form defects during their growth that kills them. They do not always grow up at all---and this certainly is not my debate against Christianity at all.
On 3:
…the population crisis is something I pull up as more of a joke…its one of those typical things you hear when debating this topic…euthanasia and eugenics as a means to save the world (again) is just a funny premise…part of my twisted humor…ignore that…
On 4:
This is the zinger…really…this old and tired argument against atheist, that we don’t have a basis for morality is absolutely and utterly ridiculous. My basis for morality is my own opinion and understanding of the world and the human psyche…not the guidance and fear programmed into us by some book or deity…we are higher level mammals, that higher level is the ability to differentiate between societal norms and our own leanings on so many different issues. Sadly I have been down this road more than once, so check this page: http://ragingrev.com/2009/01/14/atheists-morality-rehashed/ for a pretty …lengthy debate on the topic.
Rev-
Thanks for your responses as well.
1) Fair enough on the philosophical bit. My apologies. :)
Still you have a problem with whatever argument you are making. By what authority are you claiming as your standard of "protectable life"? What makes brainwaves different in sanctity from the very cells that make it happen? How can you defend a heartbeat that would never be there if not for the early stages of pulminary development in the early embryonic cells? To keep any level of consistency in your argument, you must affirm that before we get to point B, we must first pass thru point A. And science tells us they are the very same biological road.
2) I figured you'd key in on that point of the comment. Obviously, many human embryos do not grow up, because they are killed or die early in their lifespan. That's why we're having this conversation in the first place. Here again though, you are muddying the proverbial waters with yet another "key" to your abortive logic. Here you claim the issue is cogniscience, while earlier you claim the issue is heartbeats and brainwaves. Which is it? Or do you have still more levels of humanity you'd like to arbitrarily impose upon the rest of us (by an authority that you have yet to establish)?
3) There's a great movie out called "Demographic Winter" that'd be worth a watch on that issue.
4) I'll check out your post in a day or two. I've got some Hebrew to study before tomorrow morning, dealing both with the Deity and the Book you claim you can do without.
Either way, zinger or no zinger, with the atheistic argument hits the pratical pavement (as in issues such as this) they show very quickly how impotent they really are. I'd be interested to hear you make a defense of the unborn you feel should not be aborted and why, drawing from your "atheistic morals"...
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